Killing as a mage at stat gain

[Wraitheist]

I have a pretty good mage going here and I'm using a +9/+9 longbow. I've also started collecting Rods of Firebolt. I've seen others recommend collecting Rods of Firebolt and Rods of Frostbolt. What is my goal here? Carrying 2 or 3 stacks of rods and all of my spellbooks and a bow + arrows takes up a lot of space and gets heavy. Will I eventually drop the bow?

[Pete Mack]

Originally Posted by Wraitheist

I have a pretty good mage going here and I'm using a +9/+9 longbow. I've also started collecting Rods of Firebolt. I've seen others recommend collecting Rods of Firebolt and Rods of Frostbolt. What is my goal here? Carrying 2 or 3 stacks of rods and all of my spellbooks and a bow + arrows takes up a lot of space and gets heavy. Will I eventually drop the bow?

Your basic technique is fine.
As for weight, carry fewer copies of the spellbooks. And no, you won't give up the bow, though you will give up the rods after a while. You might want to carry !Heroism, as well.

[aeneas]

Originally Posted by Wraitheist

I have a pretty good mage going here and I'm using a +9/+9 longbow. I've also started collecting Rods of Firebolt. I've seen others recommend collecting Rods of Firebolt and Rods of Frostbolt. What is my goal here? Carrying 2 or 3 stacks of rods and all of my spellbooks and a bow + arrows takes up a lot of space and gets heavy. Will I eventually drop the bow?

You'll most likely wind up trading it for an even heavier one- the best easily available weapon for a mage is a monstrous ego Heavy XBow.

As to what your goal should be... well, I guess killing Morgoth is a bit vague, so... you should aim to get your stats up and get a better bow. You have a couple of choices of strategy. When you say you're at stat-gain I take it to mean you are around 1500'. The nice thing about that depth is that stat potions can be found on the ground there. The unfortunate thing about that depth is that most stuff you kill there isn't in depth to drop stat potions.

If you want to play solidly and cautiously you can get a big stack of ?detect_obj and scum 1500-1600' for stat potions, killing anything safe that could drop one (anything native to that depth, basically- young dragons are worth seeking out), until your stats are pretty high. This will likely take quite a while, but if you don't get sloppy it is pretty safe. Your biggest worry in this case should probably be Gravity Hounds. If you have autoscum on you will need to be particularly careful about them, as that makes them much more likely to show up at 1600'.

Your alternative is to go deeper so that more things can drop stat potions, and then selectively kill potion dropping stuff while avoiding things that can kill you. If you do this you want to go to at least 2200' as fast as you can (this puts everything native to 800' and deeper in depth to drop stat potions- quite a lot of packs will be available.) The key to this strategy is completely avoiding anything that is not a pushover (as opposed to starting to fight it and then bailing under disadvantageous circumstances). If you're not used to being at 2200' and deeper this strategy will likely kill you pretty quickly, but you can eventually learn how to do this safely.

About the bow- mages can do a fair bit of damage with magical combat, but they can generally do just as much or more with a decent bow. Mages also have a number of super-useful utility spells like haste, stuff from Resistances, etc. Given a limited amount of mana, it's better (from a mini-maxing-like point of view) to use your mana on the utility spells and use a bow to deal damage. If you have excess mana because you can't yet use a lot of the utility spells it can be useful to soften things up with spells and then kill them with the bow to reduce the amount of ammo you need to carry.

[Wraitheist]

Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately, my mage met an avoidable end by Kavlax. I was around 2000 and I forgot that he shows up as a 'd'. Doh.

I did finally learn that an enchanted longbow is a mage's best friend. Saving mana for utility/escape spells makes survival a lot easier.

[aeneas]

Originally Posted by Wraitheist

Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately, my mage met an avoidable end by Kavlax. I was around 2000 and I forgot that he shows up as a 'd'. Doh.

I did finally learn that an enchanted longbow is a mage's best friend. Saving mana for utility/escape spells makes survival a lot easier.

Yeah, that's part of what makes him so dangerous. I had a particularly hard time with that when I came back to V after playing a lot of NPP, where he uses a different symbol. I think I've lost at least 2 and maybe more characters to just that, and come close to losing quite a few more.

[bpleshek]

Originally Posted by aeneas

The unfortunate thing about that depth is that most stuff you kill there isn't in depth to drop stat potions.

Your alternative is to go deeper so that more things can drop stat potions, and then selectively kill potion dropping stuff while avoiding things that can kill you. If you do this you want to go to at least 2200' as fast as you can (this puts everything native to 800' and deeper in depth to drop stat potions- quite a lot of packs will be available.)

What is the formula or rule of thumb to determine what creature that is not in depth will drop like another depth?


Thanks,

Brian

[Garrie]

Originally Posted by bpleshek

What is the formula or rule of thumb to determine what creature that is not in depth will drop like another depth?


Thanks,

Brian

depth of dropped item = (depth of monster + current dlev)/2

doesn't matter if the monster is appearing early (ie "ood") or late (eg snaga at 4950')
I understand this means the best way to get stat potions is drop to 3000' and pick off the weakest monster you can find who is able to drop potions.

re-read post #3 of this thread.

[Zikke]

As an example, yesterday I saw a regular kobold at 4950' and he dropped some sort of mithril suit of armor +13.

I personally would like to see a variant (or any game for that matter) where the monsters are generated with certain weapons or armor and they have a chance to drop that gear when killed. For example if a kobold had a (20 +13) suit of mithril armor, he would have a really high AC. Or if Bert the Stone Troll has an epic unique club, his hits would *hurt* a lot. Obviously rebalancing would be in order to some degree, but it would be fun.

Wouldn't apply to most of *band since dragons wouldn't be wearing the armor and stuff they drop, but it would be neat to see in other games.

[Wraitheist]

That's an interesting idea...would love to see it in a variant.

[bpleshek]

The one I am working on has that actually. While it technically isn't a *band, it's a total rewrite(in VB.net) of my interpretation of vanilla. GFx will be similar to band, though they may also be horribly drawn cartoonish creatures(i suck at art) done up in paint.

Brian