FAangband - 64 x 64 graphics

[Magnate]

Originally Posted by Shockbolt

object_food_beef_jerky_1.png

object_food_ration_1.png

object_artifact_phial_of_galadriel_1.png

trap_spell_rune_of_teleportation_1.png

terrain_wall_dungeon_lower_1.png (bottom of the 2.5D wall)

terrain_wall_dungeon_top_1.png (top of the 2.5D wall, the part that would render partially ontop of player/npc/any object that was standing to the north)

terrain_floor_dungeon_1.png

weapon_sword_falchion_1.png

dragon_ancient_multi_colored_1.png

spiderkin_unique_ungoliant_1.png

spiderkin_spider_mirkwood_spider_1.png

Then either have the code downsize the graphics from 64x64 to 32x32 or smaller, or stick 64_ or 32_ to either the beginning of the file or the end of the file. Obviously, having the code downsize the graphics from 64 to smalles would mean a smaller .zip to download for the players.

As you see, I've ended each file with _1 , incase I go mental and decide that I want to make many versions of the same tile. This would be somewhat fun, as you could then call for the image of a broken sword, a rusty sword, a new sword, a sword that has flames running up it's blade, a sword with dripping poison etc.

No problems with the extra versions, that's fine.

Your names don't follow a clear hierarchy though. Some start with a tile category - object, trap, terrain - others start with monster type. In order to code the recognition/loading of tiles properly, the name has to break down into elements:

category_basename_name_number.png

or something. Buzzkill is right that we could use subfolders instead of long names:

lib/xtra/graf/64x64/objects/

with similar folders for monsters/ terrain/ artifacts/ misc/ etc.

But we do need to separate different-sized tiles into different-sized folders. The game supports multiple tile sets, and the code needs to know what size it's loading (regardless of whether it then shrinks or stretches the tiles).

@buzzkill: IIUC takkaria has long wanted to move to indexless edit files, so that they can be edited without breaking savefiles and without requiring any concomitant changes. If we use index numbers in tile names, they need changing every time they change in object.txt. I can't see any advantage in using them.

[Shockbolt]

I was not providing the "final" solution, merely adding fuel to the discussion-fire

removing:

terrain_
object_
monster_
weapon_
spell_
trap_
misc_
etc_

and instead just use the appropriate subfolders would work also. My only wish is that they/the tiles/the files should be easy to recognize and easy to alter/replace for non-programmers.

[Magnate]

Originally Posted by Shockbolt

I was not providing the "final" solution, merely adding fuel to the discussion-fire

removing:

terrain_
object_
monster_
weapon_
spell_
trap_
misc_
etc_

and instead just use the appropriate subfolders would work also.

Note that "weapon" and "object" are overlapping types. Categories must be MECE: mutually exclusive and collectively exhaustive - i.e. every tile belongs in one and only one category.

Since all objects are in one edit file (object.txt), there's no point in having separate tile folders/types for weapons, armour, devices, scrolls etc. But OTOH it doesn't particularly hurt if you want to, as long as the folder/type names are as set out in object_base.txt

[Shockbolt]

Originally Posted by Magnate

Note that "weapon" and "object" are overlapping types. Categories must be MECE: mutually exclusive and collectively exhaustive - i.e. every tile belongs in one and only one category.

Since all objects are in one edit file (object.txt), there's no point in having separate tile folders/types for weapons, armour, devices, scrolls etc. But OTOH it doesn't particularly hurt if you want to, as long as the folder/type names are as set out in object_base.txt

Yes, but you got my point didn't you. What I forgot to type was object_ infront of weapon_ , then again as I wrote earlier, I was not providing a final solution.

[Magnate]

Originally Posted by Shockbolt

Yes, but you got my point didn't you. What I forgot to type was object_ infront of weapon_ , then again as I wrote earlier, I was not providing a final solution.

Of course - but since you're the guy who gets to choose how your tiles are organised in folders, I just wanted to make sure you didn't end up with something we couldn't use!

[Shockbolt]

Originally Posted by Magnate

Of course - but since you're the guy who gets to choose how your tiles are organised in folders, I just wanted to make sure you didn't end up with something we couldn't use!

Ok, so how about this setup then:

Main folders:

Shockbolt_64/
Shockbolt_32/

Then the subfolders would be the same for both:

Objects/
potion_
weapon_
armor_
helmet_
shield_
food_
drink_
lightsource_
scroll_
ring_
amulet_
cloak_


Terrain/
wall_top_
wall_bottom_
wall_vertical_
floor_
door_vertical_
door_horizontal_
stair_up_
stair_down_
shop_door_

Shops/
Graphics for the various shops on lvl 0


Spells/
bolt_
bolt_lightning_dir1_ (directional bolt that travels from 9 to 1)
bolt_lightning_dir9_ (directional bolt that travels from 1 to 9)
ball_
ball_mana_1_


Traps/
spell_
acid_
physical_
physical_pit_


UI/
files for future UI graphics


Monsters/
dragon_
humanoid_
spiderkin_
undead_
unique_

Player/
dunadan_male_fighter_
elf_female_mage_

Misc/
If anything


I have not included everything, on purpose, but these examples would be something to improve upon.

[Magnate]

Looking at object_base.txt:

Originally Posted by Shockbolt

Objects/
potion_
weapon_ -- this needs to be sword, hafted, polearm
armor_ -- this needs to be hard_armor, soft_armor
helmet_ -- helm
shield_
food_
drink_ -- this needs to be food also (drinks are not separate)
lightsource_ -- light
scroll_
ring_
amulet_
cloak_

Looking at terrain.txt:

Terrain/
Shops/
Graphics for the various shops on lvl 0 -- General_Store_ etc.

Traps/
spell_ -- strange_rune or discolored_spot
acid_ -- gas_X (several types of each)
physical_ -- dart_X (ditto)
physical_pit_ -- just pit

Looking at monster_base.txt:

Monsters/
dragon_
humanoid_
spiderkin_ -- spider
undead_ -- ghost_, lich_, skeleton_, vampire_, wraith_, zombie_
unique_

[Shockbolt]

kk...I'll leave the rest up to you guys and keep pumping out tiles here myself

[Derakon]

Buzzkill: index numbers are bad because they mean reordering the list is a major pain. For example, monster.txt is mostly in order of increasing monster level, with townspeople at the beginning and Morgoth...not quite at the end, because new monsters got added and rather than reorder the entire list so they'd be at the right place, they were just tacked onto the end where there was room for them.

It's like how BASIC's enforced code line numbers were bad; any time you want to insert something into the middle, you have to push everything else down.

[Nick]

I have started a list of the distinct tiles needed for FAangband (and Beleriand) here.

There are a few relevant comments about FA which may affect tile drawing:

1. Traps and runes are not terrain, but exist 'on top of' terrain.
2. The races are quite different from Vanilla (although a lot of them are elves...)
3. There are a number of monster races which come in player race varieties; so, for example, you can have Dwarf Hardened Warrior, Green Elf Hardened Warrior, etc. Moreover, these use the same monster number and (currently) tile; the race is kind of an add-on.

I think number 3 is trickiest to deal with - as a mainly ASCII player, I haven't really let it concern me much...