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sffp December 2, 2022 01:16

My Necromancer covets your arkenstone

All the artifact lights they find hurts their spell casting abilities

Quote:

Originally Posted by malcontent (Post 158013)
Here is a bizarre item I found - it maps and lights an entire level - but I can't read any scrolls because of the -3 light :/

There are some other nice aspects to it, and some other not so nice aspects...

Code:

l) the Arkenstone of Gelwilda <+3, +5, +2, -3> (charging) {cursed}
    Taken from a chest found at 2550 feet (level 51)
   
    It paralyses you every now and then.
    It poisons you from time to time.
    +3 wisdom.
    +5 searching skill.
    +2 infravision.
    -3 light.
    Provides immunity to Fire.
    Provides resistance to Nexus, Chaos.
    Cannot be harmed by Fire.
    Feather Falling.  Prevents teleportation. 
    Intensity -3 light.
   
    When activated, it lights and maps the entire level, sensing
    objects.
    Takes 107 to 210 turns to recharge at your current speed.
    Your chance of success is 94.7%



sffp December 5, 2022 23:41

Although - not anymore:

c) the Ring of Mirith <+6, +5, +2, +4, +8, +1>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 4450 feet (level 89)

+6 intelligence.
+5 dexterity.
+2 constitution.
+4 searching skill.
+4 infravision.
+8 speed.
+1 light.
Provides immunity to Acid, Fire, Cold.
Provides resistance to Lightning, Dark.
Provides protection from fear, blindness.
Cannot be harmed by Lightning.
Sustains intelligence.
Prevents paralysis. Sustains your life force.

coupled with this:

b) the Heavy Crossbow 'Ancal' (x4) (+11,+23) <+3>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 4250 feet (level 85)

+3 strength.
Provides immunity to Lightning.
Provides resistance to Light.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.

gives him base immunity

I've never seen more than two.

Estie December 6, 2022 13:13

Thats a sweet ring. Most fighter types want damage and couldnt care less about int; youre not supposed to find this as a necromancer.

sffp December 11, 2022 18:13

I was close enough to endgame that the Con was more important to Int (I was already maxed out on Int) But it was worth 100+ HP

Going into the level I was wearing a ring of CON +6 and a ring of Speed +11
Leaving I had to artifaces that added up to the same :)

Sky December 12, 2022 11:29

prevents teleportation ...

Estie December 23, 2022 02:21

So, err, when my latest @ died an unfortunate death, I looked at the randarts and saw this:

the Mace of Disruption 'Celdach' (16d8) (+17,+28) <+2, +3>
----------------------------------------------------------
A giant's weapon, enchanted with shattering power that breaks bones, bodies,
and spirit.

+2 intelligence.
+3 wisdom.
+3 constitution.
+2 extra blows.
Slays dragons (powerfully), demons (powerfully), undead.
Branded with weak fire.
Provides resistance to Acid, Poison, Light, Dark, Nether.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Speeds regeneration. Grants the ability to see invisible things. Blessed by
the gods (combat bonuses for holy casters).


Min Level 100, Max Level 127, Generation chance 1, Power 1056, 40.0 lbs
Random hafted of power 1056.

I guess Ill have to make another paladin now, though this thing is not going to turn up early.

Ed_47569 December 24, 2022 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 159953)
So, err, when my latest @ died an unfortunate death, I looked at the randarts and saw this:

the Mace of Disruption 'Celdach' (16d8) (+17,+28) <+2, +3>
----------------------------------------------------------
A giant's weapon, enchanted with shattering power that breaks bones, bodies,
and spirit.

+2 intelligence.
+3 wisdom.
+3 constitution.
+2 extra blows.
Slays dragons (powerfully), demons (powerfully), undead.
Branded with weak fire.
Provides resistance to Acid, Poison, Light, Dark, Nether.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Speeds regeneration. Grants the ability to see invisible things. Blessed by
the gods (combat bonuses for holy casters).


Min Level 100, Max Level 127, Generation chance 1, Power 1056, 40.0 lbs
Random hafted of power 1056.

I guess Ill have to make another paladin now, though this thing is not going to turn up early.

That's got to be a record - far more powerful than Grond even!

Cryomaniac December 24, 2022 20:52

This damage output looks incredible even for more high power variants like Zangband branches.

RegalStar January 22, 2023 02:12

Quote:

the Amulet of Windori <-2, +5, +2, -3> (cursed)
Dropped by a brigand at 1350 feet (level 27)

It makes your skin harder to damage, but conduct electricity.
It periodically turns your skin to stone.
It makes you too scared to fight.
It poisons you from time to time.
-2 strength.
+5 intelligence.
+2 wisdom.
-3 dexterity.
Provides immunity to Fire.
Provides resistance to Lightning, Light.
Provides protection from confusion.
Speeds regeneration. Grants telepathy. Prevents teleportation. Drains experience.
Really wish this was actually usable as anything but an 1-turn ESP button...

PowerWyrm January 23, 2023 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by RegalStar (Post 160095)
Really wish this was actually usable as anything but an 1-turn ESP button...

Remember that you can remove curses with scrolls, you should check what power these have to see if you can remove them.

Jay January 31, 2023 00:07

I have to question Carindore's personal hygiene if, long after his boots have become legendary, they can be used to initiate a poison gas attack.


the Pair of Leather Boots of Carindore [2,+20]
----------------------------------------------
These are calf-high boots of flexible leather, laced from heel to calf.

Provides resistance to Dark.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Feather Falling. Speeds regeneration.

When activated, it fires a ball of poison gas with radius 3, dealing 12 damage
at the centre, which your device skill increases by 20% for an average of 14.4
damage.

Sky February 4, 2023 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by PowerWyrm (Post 160101)
Remember that you can remove curses with scrolls, you should check what power these have to see if you can remove them.

you can remove the first 4, but cannot remove no_tele

Ugramoth May 9, 2023 13:37

This ring is quite a confidence booster for a mid level HE blackguard:
the Band 'Haril' (+7, +1) <+4, +5, +1>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 1600 feet (level 32)

+4 intelligence.
+4 dexterity.
+5 tunneling.
+1 light.

Provides immunity to Fire
Provides resistance to Acid, Lightning, Cold, Dark, Sound, Nexus, Chaos, Disenchantment.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Lightning.
Slows your metabolism. Speeds regeneration. Prevents paralysis. Sustains your life force.

When activated, it breathes a cone of acid, lightning, fire, frost or poison gas with width 20 degrees, dealing 250 damage at the source.
Takes 164 to 240 turns to recharge.
Your chance of success is 96.1%

Estie May 9, 2023 14:13

And +7 to hit helps a little with the launcher.

Pete Mack May 10, 2023 01:51

@Estie--
Blackguards only ever carry stat sticks after the very early game. +7 is not going to make a difference for truly abysmal shooting ability. (The only use is knight's moves against druj, Wiruin, and Q, and for that accuracy is of lityle importsnce.)

Estie May 10, 2023 02:04

Well I made heave use of range despite abysmal hit chance, carrying both bless and berserk or heroism; many shots miss but its still competitive with equally terrible melee.

So yes, +7 is not the reason to equip that ring, neverthess I dont say no in that worst phase before the spells come online.

sffp May 11, 2023 21:45

So I was wearing a nice little main gauche of lightning for a while doing ~30 points of damage

when I ran into this this and this in rapid succession

d) a Ring of Damage (+0,+9)
Dropped by a mind flayer at 1150 feet (level 23)

s) a Scimitar (Holy Avenger) (7d2) (+13,+9) [+3] <+3>
Dropped by Wormtongue, Agent of Saruman, at 1150 feet (level 23)

+3 wisdom.
Slays undead, demons, evil creatures.
Provides protection from fear.
Sustains strength.
Grants the ability to see invisible things. Blessed by the gods
(combat bonuses for holy casters).



a) the Main Gauche 'Goren' (1d5) (+6,+8) <+4, +3, +1>
Found lying on the floor at 1150 feet (level 23)

+4 intelligence.
+3 dexterity.
+3 stealth.
+1 light.
Slays undead, animals.
Provides immunity to Acid, Fire.
Cannot be harmed by Acid.

Combat info:
2.8 blows/round.
With +2 STR and +0 DEX you would get 3.1 blows
With +0 STR and +2 DEX you would get 3.3 blows
Average damage/round: 87.4 vs undead, 78 vs animals, and 68.6 vs.
others.

I like the damage to evil I was getting from the HA and it was my source of FA (although I can swap in boots of FA for stealth)

But look at the double immunitiy on the main Gauche

Provides immunity to Acid, Fire.

wow

sffp May 11, 2023 22:07

SAME LEVEL (6-7 btw)

b) a Heavy Crossbow of Power (x4) (+3,+23)
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 1150 feet (level 23)

0) 26 Bolts (1d5) (+6,+6)
Combat info:
When fired, hits targets up to 140 feet away.
Average damage/round: 129.2.
20% chance of breaking upon contact.

less impressive but still quite useful

c) a Ring of Dexterity <+2>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 1150 feet (level 23)

+2 dexterity.
Sustains dexterity.



And two Dex potions!

Pete Mack May 12, 2023 00:45

@sftp--
Double immunity makes an OK weapon for mage or ranger. But without extra attacks, high damage bonus, a brand, or even slay evil it's junk as a blackguard weapon. Blackguard biggest weakness early on is in damage. That weapon makes the problem worse.

sffp May 12, 2023 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack (Post 160848)
@sftp--
Double immunity makes an OK weapon for mage or ranger. But without extra attacks, high damage bonus, a brand, or even slay evil it's junk as a blackguard weapon. Blackguard biggest weakness early on is in damage. That weapon makes the problem worse.

Interesting.
I find my BG's dying (almost all the time) around 1500-2000 because I run out of Cure potions/escapes. I probably need them because I'm not doing enough damage. What raw number do you think they need btw? I've got this Main Gauche doing around 143/round at 1800' btw

Pete Mack May 13, 2023 17:51

Here's one that plugged a few holes. It let me dump a whole bunch of not quite good enough armor, and poison resistance+ CON really eased constraints on other equipment.

Code:

g) the Partial Plate Armour of Elorlad (-3) [40,+16] <+2>
    Dropped by Glaurung, Father of the Dragons, at 4000 feet (level
    80)
    +2 constitution.
    Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, poison, light,
    chaos.
    Provides protection from fear, blindness, stunning.
    Cannot be harmed by acid.
    Slows your metabolism.  Grants the ability to see invisible
    things.

In contrast, my main weapon is a not-quite-great ego weapon.
Code:

a) an Executioner's Sword of Extra Attacks (4d5) (+16,+17) <+2>
    Found lying on the floor at 3050 feet (level 61)
   
    +2 extra blows.
   
    Combat info:
    7.0 blows/round.
    This weapon may benefit from one or more off-weapon brands or
    slays.
    Average damage/round: 551.6 vs creatures not resistant to
    lightning and 441 vs. others

For paladin, blows trumps brands and slays because of slay evil and kill demon spells. Off weapon weak brand helps too.

wobbly May 13, 2023 20:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by sffp (Post 160852)
Interesting.
I find my BG's dying (almost all the time) around 1500-2000 because I run out of Cure potions/escapes. I probably need them because I'm not doing enough damage. What raw number do you think they need btw? I've got this Main Gauche doing around 143/round at 1800' btw

Arguably what you want is any big dice weapon, preferably with a brand, but even an unbranded BoC, Mod or SoS should be up for contention.

The venom brand spell will give a bigger boost on a higher dice weapon. Obvious not so great against anything with poison immunity, but when the weapon is already branded, then there's a much lower chance that they resist both elements.

Werewolf form and bloodlust increase blows, again there is more of a boost from these with a heavier weapon.

Pete Mack May 13, 2023 21:04

His trouble is getting out of stat gain. And for that, any weapon that does the most damage per turn against most monsters. Haradekket would be ideal--good dice, about the right weight, and extra attacks. But weapon choice is more of a lottery for BG than for any other class.

wobbly May 15, 2023 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack (Post 160855)
His trouble is getting out of stat gain. And for that, any weapon that does the most damage per turn against most monsters. Haradekket would be ideal--good dice, about the right weight, and extra attacks. But weapon choice is more of a lottery for BG than for any other class.

a) a Scythe of Slicing (8d4) (+0,+0)
Found lying on the floor at 650 feet (level 13)

Well ok, it needs enchanting and you don't get venom brand till clvl 28. stats aside its 2 blows with whirlwind at clvl 20 and 3 at clvl 35.

Estie May 15, 2023 16:31

And oh so fitting.

wobbly May 15, 2023 21:59

This one is interesting in the sense that the recharge time on the activate is shorter then the effect length.

Code:

e) the Amulet 'Gilirhuri' <+2, +3>
    Dropped by Brodda, the Easterling, at 800 feet (level 16)
   
    +2 strength.
    +3 searching skill.
    +3 tunneling.
    Provides resistance to dark, chaos.
    Sustains wisdom, constitution.
    Slows your metabolism.  Grants the ability to see invisible
    things. 
   
    When activated, it hastes you for a while, but then makes you
    slower for a while afterward.
    Takes 82 to 90 turns to recharge at your current speed.
    Your chance of success is 89.5%


sffp July 13, 2023 16:33

Classic LOOT!!!
 
o) the Band 'Elduinur'
Dropped by Wormtongue, Agent of Saruman, at 500 feet (level 10)

Cannot be harmed by Lightning.
Aggravates creatures nearby.


My first ring!

Jay July 18, 2023 05:31

Wish I was playing a ranger for this one. Still, my warrior is making good use of it.

the Long Bow of Elpion (x4) (+7,+29) <+5, +3, +1>

+5 strength.
+3 dexterity.
+1 searching skill.
+1 shooting power.
Slays evil creatures.
Branded with cold.
Provides resistance to Acid, Lightning, Light.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Sustains intelligence.
Prevents paralysis.

When activated, it fires a ball of acid with radius 2, dealing 120 damage at
the centre, which your device skill increases by 23% for an average of 147.6
damage.
Takes 279 to 341 turns to recharge.
Your chance of success is 95.4%

Estie July 18, 2023 11:48

Nice one; now hope you dont find a Lothlorien with ESP :P

sffp July 19, 2023 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay (Post 161175)
Wish I was playing a ranger for this one. Still, my warrior is making good use of it.

the Long Bow of Elpion (x4) (+7,+29) <+5, +3, +1>

+5 strength.
+3 dexterity.
+1 searching skill.
+1 shooting power.
Slays evil creatures.
Branded with cold.
Provides resistance to Acid, Lightning, Light.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Sustains intelligence.
Prevents paralysis.

When activated, it fires a ball of acid with radius 2, dealing 120 damage at
the centre, which your device skill increases by 23% for an average of 147.6
damage.
Takes 279 to 341 turns to recharge.
Your chance of success is 95.4%

+5 strength, +3 dex - useful for just about anyone

Jay July 20, 2023 05:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by sffp (Post 161182)
+5 strength, +3 dex - useful for just about anyone

True — it'd be helpful for a lot of classes to carry even if they rarely used it.

In this case, I can confirm that it was quite helpful in knocking off Morgoth. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie
Nice one; now hope you dont find a Lothlorien with ESP :P

I was really lucky with artifacts with ESP this game. Ended up with three different randart helmets with it, along with some other nice characteristics. Spoiled for choice, really. Quite a contrast from some other recent games where I was scrambling for it.

Sky July 22, 2023 10:22

once you get to DL90 ESP is pretty much on everything, if not on randarts, and for some reason you cannot free the head slot, cloaks of the magi have it, and so do lothloriens. cloaks are vastly more abundant, and i find that the randart cloak slot tends to have alltogether less bonuses than other slots.

Ed_47569 July 31, 2023 20:26

Found in a vault just after killing Morgoth with a warrior (used MoD HA). Never seen +20 speed on a weapon before... Now I don't want to retire the character!

a) the Mace 'Eitharn' (8d4) (+7,+15) [+2] <+1, +4, +20>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 5000 feet (level 100)

+1 wisdom.
+4 tunneling.
+20 speed.
Slays undead, demons, giants, orcs, evil creatures.
Branded with poison.
Provides immunity to Fire.
Provides resistance to Acid, Lightning, Cold.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Sustains dexterity.
Speeds regeneration. Grants the ability to see invisible things.


When activated, it breathes a cone of acid, lightning, fire,
frost, or poison gas with width 20 degrees, dealing 250 damage at
the source.
Takes 688 to 1008 turns to recharge at your current speed.
Your chance of success is 95.6%

Combat info:
6.0 blows/round.
Average damage/round: 790.2 vs undead, demons, giants, orcs, and
creatures not resistant to poison, 637.8 vs evil creatures, and
485.4 vs. others.

Estie July 31, 2023 20:50

Thats a nice one. Now you can equip 2 damage rings!

Ed_47569 July 31, 2023 23:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 161233)
Thats a nice one. Now you can equip 2 damage rings!

Ended up at +51 speed and went back down to slaughter the remaining Uniques... Ancalagon, the two dogs and the Tarrasque.

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=25614

PowerWyrm August 1, 2023 09:37

Sounds like a bug to me... weapons should not have +20 speed.

Estie August 1, 2023 12:49

Occasionally the game creates a weapon with a 4 digit pool worth of attributes.
This weapon has a low probability to be created. It is also likely to have a minimum depth of 100, which makes it extremely unlikely to show up before you kill Morgoth.
Then normally this weapon ends up being not the best weapon in the game; for example, it might be a whip 3d3 base and have a long list of defensive stats.

I have seen (as in, read in the file after the game, not found) many of these and I have never seen double speed. I cant remember having seen ~10 speed either, but I may just not remember it. I assume the chance for +20 speed, provided the game decides to put speed on the weapon and the property pool is high enough, is the the same as for a ring to get +20 speed.

So, sometimes there is an enourmos fish down in the depth. I dont know if thats a bug; but finding big fish is the main reason for me to play, so I wouldnt want them removed.

backwardsEric August 1, 2023 14:00

1 Attachment(s)
The log for concocting that particular artifact is attached. The target power was 862. It received a supercharged speed bonus of 18 (chance of 5/139 to get that in this case - boots are more likely to get). The base supercharged bonus is 4+1d6 speed. There's a 1/2 chance (not dependent on item type) the base bonus is boosted to 4+1d6+1d3. There's a 1/6 chance (not dependent on item type) that base bonus is boosted to 5+2d6. In this case both bonuses were applied (1/12 chance) for a bonus of 5+2d6+1d3 (1/8 chance of being +18, 1/16 chance of being +19, 1/48 chance of being +20). The speed bonus was later adjusted to +20. The final power of the artifact was 851 with 400 of that coming from the speed bonus. As Estie guessed, the artifact's minimum depth is 100.

Estie August 1, 2023 14:37

Very interesting - but I dont think boots can get more than 10 speed, only rings.

4 + 1d6 would fit the boots range; if that is supercharged values, then what do not supercharged speed boots look like ?

Anything above 10 speed is either a ring or an artifact.

Estie August 1, 2023 15:01

Hmm I looked at that log; half of the actions are calculating value for the artifact property of being immune to elements. And very particular values - immunity to acid is worth 3, to lightning 1. There is a value assigned for each element and that value is taken into account multiple times in the process of creating the artifact.

This seems not a very economic approach when all we want to achieve is to make artifacts indestructible - there is no need to assign a value to that property if every artifact gets it anyway.

So this is how those early artifacts with no actual properties get created, then.

Ed_47569 August 1, 2023 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by backwardsEric (Post 161241)
The log for concocting that particular artifact is attached. The target power was 862. It received a supercharged speed bonus of 18 (chance of 5/139 to get that in this case - boots are more likely to get). The base supercharged bonus is 4+1d6 speed. There's a 1/2 chance (not dependent on item type) the base bonus is boosted to 4+1d6+1d3. There's a 1/6 chance (not dependent on item type) that base bonus is boosted to 5+2d6. In this case both bonuses were applied (1/12 chance) for a bonus of 5+2d6+1d3 (1/8 chance of being +18, 1/16 chance of being +19, 1/48 chance of being +20). The speed bonus was later adjusted to +20. The final power of the artifact was 851 with 400 of that coming from the speed bonus. As Estie guessed, the artifact's minimum depth is 100.

Here's the entry from my Randart log...

# Random hafted of power 851
name:'Eitharn'
base-object:hafted:Mace
level:20
weight:120
cost:30000
alloc:17:100 to 127
attack:8d4:7:15
armor:0:2
flags:SUST_DEX | REGEN | SEE_INVIS
values:WIS[1] | TUNNEL[4] | SPEED[20]
values:RES_ACID[1] | RES_ELEC[1] | RES_FIRE[3] | RES_COLD[1]
slay:UNDEAD_3
slay:DEMON_3
slay:GIANT_3
slay:ORC_3
slay:EVIL_2
brand:POIS_3
act:DRAGON_MULTIHUED
time:160+4d20
desc:Random hafted of power 851


And yes, it was found at 5000' in a GV, just after killing M.

Pete Mack August 1, 2023 20:36

Cost is 30K, which is ridiculously low. The cost per se doesn't matter, but this thing should guarantee item LF 8 at least.

Sky August 1, 2023 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 161242)
Very interesting - but I dont think boots can get more than 10 speed, only rings.

artifact? or BoS?
artifact boots can have more than 10 Spd.

Ed_47569 August 1, 2023 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack (Post 161245)
Cost is 30K, which is ridiculously low. The cost per se doesn't matter, but this thing should guarantee item LF 8 at least.

It gave a 9 feeling, also found a decent randart RoP next to it in the vault.

Ed_47569 August 1, 2023 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sky (Post 161246)
artifact? or BoS?
artifact boots can have more than 10 Spd.

I've seen +14 on randart boots before, but nothing to match standart Feanor (+15). Best RoS I ever found was +22.

Estie August 2, 2023 06:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sky (Post 161246)
artifact? or BoS?
artifact boots can have more than 10 Spd.

Quote:

Anything above 10 speed is either a ring or an artifact.
For some reason above message doesnt count towards the post minimum, so I have to add stuff.

Estie August 9, 2023 22:42

So, started a new dwarf priest to play along with the borg. The first artifact I found, at dlvl 17, dropped by Orfax, was Wrath. Which would be worthy of a post except I wanted to set randarts and apparently havent. So I post anyway, and restart.

Jay October 7, 2023 00:25

I think these are together the highest bonuses to hit and to damage I've seen on gloves. No attribute bonuses but fortunately I've got enough of those elsewhere.

The Set of Leather Gloves of Tauru (+17, +9) [1, +10]
Provides resistance to Cold, Dark, Sound.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by Acid, Fire.
Sustains dexterity.

Estie October 7, 2023 18:50

If only it was (+9, +17).

Pete Mack October 7, 2023 21:56

It's still roughly equivalent to a ring of damage +16...without wasting a ring slot. In my current game I two-fisted RoD for +25 damage,til I finally found a weak speed ring--with 2 real curses +1 useless!--at DL 67. Fortunately I had 4 *remove curse.* One failed at power 62; two succeeded. Meaningless poison curse still remains.

Jay October 9, 2023 02:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 161580)
If only it was (+9, +17).

I figure it's roughly equivalent to a +9 RoD and a perpetual heroism spell, or something like that. Still higher than any gloves I've seen before.

Estie October 9, 2023 03:49

Its in the same ballpark as Fingolfin and Cambeleg, but yes, that quality of gloves is rare in randarts. I usually end up using "of Combat" for the last fights when aggravation doesnt matter any more. Those go up to +11 damage if the base is cestus.

Estie October 13, 2023 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack (Post 161581)
It's still roughly equivalent to a ring of damage +16

How do you arrive at that estimation ?

Pete Mack October 13, 2023 20:43

Damage is roughly equal to half accuracy, except for priests and especially mages. (And a ring of +16 damage is astonishingly good in any case--I have never seen better than +13.)

PowerDiver October 13, 2023 21:40

10 years ago, I used to think that to-hit was worth half as much as to-dam for melee, but the last few times I cranked through a calculation it was worth much less. I don't know whether I was wrong then or if the game changes shifted the utility a lot.

Pete Mack October 13, 2023 21:57

I don't think hit probability it has changed in my memory. I would like to see the calculation.

Estie October 14, 2023 01:31

By gut feeling, Id say to hit is worth less that 1/2 damage. It is difficult to use calculations for several reasons.
Firstly, the effect depends on the AC of what you are fighting (and here I would love to see a function of how average damage depends on enemy AC).
Secondly, not all fights are equally important. I would think, but I am not sure, that important fights typically involve above average AC.
Thirdly, in case of overkill damage in 1 round, extra to hit is very welcome. For example, imagine a situation where nexus hounds are trickling out and a survivor is likely to run with potential to cause trouble.

Pete Mack October 14, 2023 01:49

I did a calculation for a CL 42 Paladin vs AC 150 doing 505 damage with Ulmo vs animals (and evil with a spell.) +20 with buffs increases effective damage from 363 to 386, equivalent to 5 nominal damage per blow. That is, accuracy is about 25% as valuable as damage for a melee class. If for some reason you wanted to melee Morgoth as a mage, it would be significantly more, possibly close to 50%.

Sky October 14, 2023 02:05

funny, i think the highest Damage i have seen was a +15, with +13s being abundant. But assuming +13 is equal to a Ring of Speed +10 in rarity, i've seen RoS +14 (and more, but +14 isn't insanely rare) and higher but never any Damage higher than +15.

Sky October 19, 2023 19:23

started this HE Mage yesterday, today closed the deal.
Decided to Rune & melee Morgoth because:

the Blue Dragon Scale Mail of Hillome (-2) [12,+39] <+3, +2>
------------------------------------------------------------
+3 intelligence.
+2 attack speed.
Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, poison, light, shards,
nexus, nether, disenchantment.
Provides protection from fear, blindness.
Slows your metabolism. Prevents paralysis.

When activated, it restores all your stats and your experience points.
Takes 139 to 187 turns to recharge.
Your chance of success is 98.6%


Min Level 87, Max Level 127, Generation chance 18, Power 603, 10.0 lbs
Random dragon armor of power 603.

Pete Mack October 19, 2023 20:44

+13 Damage is conditionally equivalent to a +10 RoSpeed. If you've got base speed 25, yes. If you have an midgsme weapon or an ordinary endgame weapon yes. But if you've got +2 attacks MoD with Slay Evil spell, or some massive damage randart, no.

PowerDiver October 19, 2023 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack (Post 161622)
I don't think hit probability it has changed in my memory. I would like to see the calculation.

There was a massive change. Just notice that armor values are double what they were in 3.0.

Pete Mack October 19, 2023 22:02

I remember it being significant. I'd forgotten it was huge. Abolishing the shield spell for 50% of the classes makes up for some of it. Abolishing a number of other buffs makes up for more. (I rarely have double cold resistance anymore, and only sometimes have double fire resistance.)

Grotug October 21, 2023 10:44

the Mace of Disruption of Arfearth (9d8) (+9,+11)
Dropped by Saruman of Many Colours at 3000 feet (level 60)

Slays undead, demons, orcs.
Branded with cold.
Provides resistance to cold.
Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.

Combat info:
1.6 blows/round.
With +6 STR and +0 DEX you would get 2.0 blows
With +0 STR and +2 DEX you would get 2.0 blows
Average damage/round: 282.1 vs undead, demons, orcs, and creatures
not resistant to cold, and 119.6 vs. others.

I'll start wielding it when my wis gets a little higher.

Sky October 24, 2023 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grotug (Post 161688)
the Mace of Disruption of Arfearth (9d8) (+9,+11)
Dropped by Saruman of Many Colours at 3000 feet (level 60)

Slays undead, demons, orcs.
Branded with cold.
Provides resistance to cold.
Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.

Combat info:
1.6 blows/round.
With +6 STR and +0 DEX you would get 2.0 blows
With +0 STR and +2 DEX you would get 2.0 blows
Average damage/round: 282.1 vs undead, demons, orcs, and creatures
not resistant to cold, and 119.6 vs. others.

I'll start wielding it when my wis gets a little higher.

i wonder how much damage would a hydra take from this thing.

Pete Mack October 24, 2023 22:41

At the current damage, 376 DPT. At 4.0 blows, 940 DPT. At 4.7*, 1107 DPT.

* IIIRC this is the most possible with a MoD.

Estie October 25, 2023 03:07

Max MoD blows are 5.2 for warriors, 4 for pure casters and 5 for everyone else (not sure about BG).

Ed_47569 October 29, 2023 23:54

This is pretty good.

g) the Law Dragon Scale Mail 'Livrast' (-2) [40,+26] <+3, +2>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 3400 feet (level 68)

+3 wisdom.
+2 speed.
Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, poison, light,
dark, sound, shards, nexus, nether.
Provides protection from fear, blindness, confusion.
Sustains intelligence, constitution.
Feather Falling. Speeds regeneration. Prevents paralysis.

When aimed, it breathes a cone of sound or shards with width 20
degrees, dealing 230 damage at the source.
Takes 175 turns to recharge at your current speed.
Your chance of success is 94.5%

Ed_47569 October 30, 2023 00:47

Same character, playing a warrior...I mean, what even is this?!!!!

a) the Mace of Disruption of Elpel (5d8) (+20,+30) [+2] <+5, +2> (charging)
Dropped by Pazuzu, Lord of Air, at 4400 feet (level 88)

+5 intelligence.
+2 extra blows.
Slays undead (powerfully), dragons (powerfully), demons
(powerfully), trolls, animals, evil creatures.
Provides resistance to dark.
Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.
Sustains your life force.

When activated, it destroys an area around you in the shape of a
circle radius 15, and blinds you for 1d10+10 turns.
Takes 343 to 420 turns to recharge at your current speed.
Your chance of success is 92.0%

Combat info:
7.2 blows/round.
Average damage/round: 1561.5 vs undead, dragons, and demons,
1149.3 vs trolls, 943.2 vs animals and evil creatures, and 737.1
vs. others.

Ed_47569 October 30, 2023 01:20

And again, same character as the last two...3 immunities on one ring! V4.2.5

x) the Band 'Tirmen' <+3>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 4600 feet (level 92)

+3 wisdom.
+3 constitution.
+3 stealth.
Provides immunity to acid, lightning, cold.
Provides resistance to poison, nether, disenchantment.
Provides protection from fear.
Cannot be harmed by lightning.
Slows your metabolism. Grants the ability to see invisible
things. Prevents paralysis.

When activated, it heals 1200 hit points, cut damage, and cures
stunning, poisoning, blindness, and confusion.
Takes 573 to 772 turns to recharge at your current speed.
Your chance of success is 95.7%

PowerWyrm October 30, 2023 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed_47569 (Post 161778)
Same character, playing a warrior...I mean, what even is this?!!!!

a) the Mace of Disruption of Elpel (5d8) (+20,+30) [+2] <+5, +2> (charging)
Dropped by Pazuzu, Lord of Air, at 4400 feet (level 88)

+5 intelligence.
+2 extra blows.
Slays undead (powerfully), dragons (powerfully), demons
(powerfully), trolls, animals, evil creatures.
Provides resistance to dark.
Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.
Sustains your life force.

When activated, it destroys an area around you in the shape of a
circle radius 15, and blinds you for 1d10+10 turns.
Takes 343 to 420 turns to recharge at your current speed.
Your chance of success is 92.0%

Combat info:
7.2 blows/round.
Average damage/round: 1561.5 vs undead, dragons, and demons,
1149.3 vs trolls, 943.2 vs animals and evil creatures, and 737.1
vs. others.

Grond without the penalties...

Grotug October 30, 2023 13:48

*Grotug bows before the God of Angband.*

I keep playing Ranger to get an insane launcher, but I only get good or very good launchers, but no broken launchers. That Mace is the absolute dream. Like the perfect weapon. High dice, high enchantment, and all the slays. When a weapon doesn't hold back in any metric of damage. Even a mage could rearrange their kit to kill morgoth with that.

Ed_47569 October 30, 2023 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grotug (Post 161782)
*Grotug bows before the God of Angband.*

I keep playing Ranger to get an insane launcher, but I only get good or very good launchers, but no broken launchers. That Mace is the absolute dream. Like the perfect weapon. High dice, high enchantment, and all the slays. When a weapon doesn't hold back in any metric of damage. Even a mage could rearrange their kit to kill morgoth with that.

I was certainly happy with it...went on to find the One Ring on Level 99 for some extra speed and +15 damage too! Quickest fight ever against Morgoth, was doing just over 1000 damage per round vs Evil.

Sky November 1, 2023 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed_47569 (Post 161784)
I was certainly happy with it...went on to find the One Ring on Level 99 for some extra speed and +15 damage too! Quickest fight ever against Morgoth, was doing just over 1000 damage per round vs Evil.

YOU WHAT ???

omg no noooooo

Ed_47569 November 2, 2023 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sky (Post 161793)
YOU WHAT ???

omg no noooooo

Well Sauron was already dead at this point, so he had no further use for it!

Sky November 4, 2023 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed_47569 (Post 161794)
Well Sauron was already dead at this point, so he had no further use for it!

tsk tsk tsk.

https://www.google.com/search?q=can+sauron+be+killed

Grotug November 6, 2023 16:06

.....
....
...
..
.
Quote:

Originally Posted by helge kåre fauskanger quoting lotr
"concerning this thing [the ring], my lords, you now all know enough for the understanding of our plight, and of sauron’s. [...] if it is destroyed, then he will fall; and his fall will be so low that none can foresee his arising ever again. For he will lose the best part of the strength that was native to him in his beginning, and all that was made or begun with that power will crumble, and he will be maimed for ever, becoming a mere spirit of malice that gnaws itself in the shadows, but cannot again grow or take shape. And so a great evil of this world will be removed."


Ed_47569 November 13, 2023 00:28

Not too shabby!

p) the Pair of Steel Shod Boots 'Ainath' [7,+10] <+11>
Found lying on the floor in a vault at 3650 feet (level 73)

+11 speed.
Provides resistance to acid, cold.
Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.
Grants telepathy. Prevents paralysis.

Thraalbee November 13, 2023 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed_47569 (Post 161844)
Not too shabby!

Boots of Free Action with a few optional extras. I'd take them!


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